Question for Christians

“The murder is only different because the baby is in the mother's belly instead of on her knee.

Have you killed an unborn baby?”

“Not directly.”

“

"Hello? Hello?"”

“You did not answer my question...do you have children?”

“No.

Have you killed an unborn baby?

(don't pull a tilt and insist I answer, but you avoid answering)”

“making my 10 yr old baby girl go thru it. that judge or any other man has no clue about childbirth and the pain...not to mention what it would do to her little body... - divinity

Ignoring the sexist statement that I underlined, in this case I would be able to morally justify abortion.”

“My answer is no. have you?”

“Of course I have not.

Ok, so you haven't killed an unborn baby. Shall I now conclude that you are unqualified to speak on the subject?
last edited: 6/08/10 6:26:56 AM”

“And what makes you qualified?”

“Ignore him Div.”

“div - this is one of those examples that I agree and realize that I'm totally inconsistant on my stance on abortion. I sleep just fine at night with the inconsistancy and hope I'm never in the position to actually make that call. We were offered amnio with each of our pregnancies and we declined each time because it would not change our decision, just add stress to the pregnancy. The rape/incest thing is a different ball game to me.”

“Nothing in particular makes me more or less qualified than you. That is why I did not challenge your authority by asking personal questions about your experiences - unlike you, who did ask me questions about my personal experience, as if that would make me more or less qualified.

Is any of this starting to sink in yet?”

“So, back on topic.

As previously stated, the first order of business should be determining if abortion is or is not in fact, murder.

If it is - then the responses to the questions raised take on a whole new meaning.”

“notice how "sink" is underlined

in other words



”

“everyone stay calm!

hpd is in charge of this thread!”

“I personally want to know why the hell the government should have any say EITHER WAY?

Its a personal decision, don't fund it, if doctors don't want to do it DON'T MAKE THEM.

Sorry there are a heck of a lot of things the government should be doing before they get involved in this. Now if a local government wants to have a "no Abortion" policy...great...you want an abortion go somewhere else. But Federally....its like Medical Marijuana....leave it up to the States to manage...IT AIN'T Uncle Sam's job.”

“How many crack orphans do you lifers take care of? Get your asses out and look around at what lifer policies would have done to this world since 1973. Face the fact that it is law and let others live with what is best for them under real world situations. How would you pukes like to have no choice in religion or completely lose your right to believe the lies you do?”

“dayhiker - If (hypothetically) your daughter (again, hypothetically) had a 1 week old baby and it was the result of rape, and this baby was reminding her of the experience and draining on her mentally, would you kill the baby?”

“IT AIN'T Uncle Sam's job - XL

Correct.”

“crash, if you'll recall (from earlier this morning), it was divinity who challenged me on my right to speak on the subject, not the other way around. I just pointed this out to her by turning the tables. But alas, she has boobs, so you see it differently. To me, it's you that is the sexist.”

“alas, youre a boob, and im not taking you or any of this seriously”

“no, but you did give your stamp of "disapproval" as is your daily MO”

“I would not and yes, I realize I'm being inconsistant. I believe I stated that already though”

“no, but you did give your stamp of "disapproval" as is your daily MO

implying im not just fvcking with you for sh4ts and giggles because youre so easy

indicating that youve forgotten that i agree with you on the topic”

“dayhiker - I understand. I can sympathize with your situation. To take it a step further (I realize it's hypothetical for YOU and ME, but for somebody else, this is very real and an important topic) it would be reasonable to ask "why?". Why would you be okay with killing the baby who is not born, but not the baby who has been born?

I think the answer would be very much aligned with the logic "out of sight, out of mind". I cannot accept that (for myself) because that is just another way of saying I am not willing to face the harsh reality in order to make my life simpler.

Understand? What are your thoughts?”

“implying im not just fvcking with you for sh4ts and giggles because youre so easy

indicating that youve forgotten that i agree with you on the topic”
crash bang
9:55:20 AM
6/08/10

No, I was not implying that at all. I totally understand you do it for fun. I just, also for fun, like to point out your bias and inconsistencies.”

“Why would you be okay

Why would anyone have to be "okay" with abortion to justify it in certain circumstances?”

“Lifers will take more than your freedom to abortion, next they'll want total theocracy that dictates your whole life and non-Christians will be the Palestinians of this country.”

“"okay" meaning you've weighed the pros and cons and have decided to go along with it”

“except im not taking div's side AT ALL. i was just riffing on the fact that the website made a hyperlink out of the word "sink" and i just ran with it. not everything is about you”

“Mutt...yes...that may be a sexist remark...but have ynu experienced the pain of childbirth? women have the right to play that card hpd...you did ask me a personal question.”

“if anything, because men DONT experience the childbirth, and generally dont bond with their children as deeply as a mother does, they can then be more objective about the topic, because they are more removed from the conflict”

“therefore, div's insinuation that because men dont experience the pain of childbirth, they are unqualified to talk about the subject is a sexist one

still luv ya tho, div! and not just for ya boobs!”

“and generally dont bond with their children as deeply as a mother does - crash

More sexism.”

“HPD - I realized you were going in the direction of out of sight, out of mind. I don't know if that's it or not. Maybe it's able to be seen, not able to be seen? Again, don't know. Somehow, for me, those situations get an asterisk. They're special conditions. OTOH, I don't think God uses asterisks. The Bible is full of stories of good things coming from bad origins. I'm fine not having all the answers and fine with the paradox.”

“More sexism.�
Mutt

more divisiveness for the sake of being divisive”

“Wow...the boob comments aren't sexist remarks?...you will never understand until you have a baby girl of your own. i love my children... i would kill to protect my children. i do not believe in abortion as birth control...i do think there are situations and emergency health issues that it can apply to. i do not think taxpayers should pay for them.”

“Hardly, crash. You made a ridiculous assertion. I called you on it.”

“you know what, mutt? just for you, ill throw that remark about bonding out. it's really not that strongly supportive of the main point and probably an over-generalization anyways

but the main point still stands. and i only throw that at somebody if they try to say or insinuate that men have no business entering the discussion. but the fact is, men and women can both be in the discussion”

“So div. Because you love your children you would kill somebody because they upset your child?

---

[b]“hpd...you did ask me a personal question.”
Divinity

Right. It was to make the point that your question is invalid. You can't go around saying somebody else's opinion is invalid because they didn't do "X", but yet pretend your opinion is valid, even though you didn't do "Y". According to you, you have not killed an unborn baby, therefore, ACCORDING TO YOUR LOGIC (not mine), you are unqualified to speak on the topic of killing unborn babies.”

“dayhiker - I agree with what you've said except for one thing. Yes, good things come from bad origins, but that does not mean that we should be apathetic in trying to avoid "bad". God is the one who makes good things come from bad origins, not us, and He does it in His timing. I, like you, don't believe the Bible has a checklist of right/wrong solutions to problems, but we are supposed to sincerely search for truth and try to determine the "right thing to do".”

“I, like you, don't believe the Bible has a checklist of right/wrong solutions to problems, but we are supposed to sincerely search for truth and try to determine the "right thing to do".�

if i said that to a fundamentalist, i'd probably get called a relativist”

“I agree...abortion is murder...raping my child is a litte different than upsetting my child...and you questioned my authority...”

“if i said that to a fundamentalist, i'd probably get called a relativist

If they didn't understand the term. Seeking the truth to a fundamentalist means praying, reading the Bible, learning about God's nature and His relationship with us, and then honestly seeking from that accumulated knowledge the desire of God for us. Relativism essentially is when anything you do is okay - a completely different meaning.”

“I agree...abortion is murder...

Good.

raping my child is a litte different than upsetting my child...

We agree 1,000% on that. But, murdering an unborn child is what we're talking about, not the rape, which is done. Murdering an unborn child is a little different that upsetting your child.

and you questioned my authority.

Again, I did not. I made a point that when you questioned my authority it was fallacious. Just the fact that you noticed it when I did it (to show you) and not when you did it shows that you are not being open minded about this.”

“rel�a�tiv�ism (rěl'ə-tĭ-vĭz'əm)
n. Philosophy
A theory, especially in ethics or aesthetics, that conceptions of truth and moral values are not absolute but are relative to the persons or groups holding them.

NOT

"anything you do is ok"

but people like you think it is, and use it as an insult”

“Disagreed crash. Your definition is correct, but what I was stating was the result of relativism, not the definition.”

“relativism is essentially taking as many factors (environmental, psychological, etc) into account as possible before deciding the correct course of action

it is the antithesis of biblical literalism”

“Agreed crash, but again, the result of that thinking is that anything can be okay because you can always find something else to justify the action. It's "relative" to the thing you are comparing it to.”

“what I was stating was the PERCEIVED result of relativism, not the definition

fix'd”