Life in y2s country where govt #1

“XL - I've said a time or two in this thread that I understand those issues. I respect those issues. Those issues are not the issue at hand which is why I keep pointing out that the dude freaked after what was going on was obvious.”

“oh but dayhiker. you cant understand. its such a deep profound thing that you have to be there and actually be a cop just like xl is to understand it. wait.......”

“crash - excuse me, but I think you've missed something too (like Sass).

XL started saying that whole you can't say something unless you've been there thing in RESPONSE to other people saying that about women and abortions.

He says it sarcastically from time to time.

You saying it right back to him sarcastically is only making his point.”

“ok, well, if he is, only he can say for certain

i dont think he is, personally. thats something you might do. xl tends to be a little more direct

anyways, it would be pointless, because i dont use the "youve never been there" response when it comes to abortion, and am very strongly against abortion myself. as a matter of fact, i would argue that a woman is TOO close to the issue to be able to make an objective opinion, so that tactic would have the opposite effect desired
last edited: 2/13/08 7:24:41 AM”

“Hey Dayhiker here is another (crash this is like all of them they REALLY happened)
\
Its about half an hour before shift change in the mid eighties I think. A transsexual/transvestite prostitute know around the station for a major drug problem manages to breach security and stumbles into the Lockerroom looking for help. She/it is disoriented and screaming. Suddenly it collapses...there are open sores around the mouth...it is quite apparent the prostitute may be having a Heart Attack ....an officer jumps out of the assmebled and without a thought starts mouth to mouth and CPR.....

What would you say that officer deserves?”

“crash - He's said that from the git-go when the abortion thing came up before. He's directing it to all silly libbies, not just you.

See XL, don't ever say I don't defend you.”

“crash this is like all of them they REALLY happened)

when did i say or imply that your stories didnt happen (other than possibly facetiously)?”

“Thanks Sarge...oh and crash that officer who tried vainly to save an OD (Black Transvestite with AIDS) was an officer branded a racist by the media...his name was Sgt. Stacey Koon.”

“well, xl? is he right?”

“I wish they'd fix the google search engine, I could prove it by going to the thread it started.”

“wtf does that story have to do with anything, o king of the non-sequiturs?

but it does have me curious why he was called a racist”

“XL - you seem to believe because I'm arguing against the incident in question that I'm somehow against law enforcement or don't value what they bring to the table. That's incorrect.

But to answer your question, I'd say he performed a heroic deed that 99% of the general populace would not attempt. I would also say it's doubtful that he SHOULD have attempted to do what he did because of personal risk of infectious disease but am also cognisant that the media could/would have blistered him afterwards for not making the attempt. See, I really do understand and often agree with the points you've been making, JUST NOT FOR THE INCIDENT THAT THIS THREAD IS ABOUT.

I do worry about your reading comprehension from time to time.”

“PS, you didn't state whether this was a police or firehouse lockeroom. If firehouse, I'd have the dudes head examined for not running into the next room for one of those breather pumpy things that EMS dudes use all the time on TV.”

“I could prove it by going to the thread it started.��

just cuz he said he was being sarc before doesnt mean he is now, or isnt”

“Well, he hasn't stopped doing it since. Once or twice a week he throws in that sarcasm ever since. It wouldn't make sense that he'd ridicule that type of logic, then immediately use the same logic so blatantly.”

“xl doesnt argue in good faith. therefore i dont have faith in him to be consistent”

“Day...the thing you don't understand (oh that is why I place all your comments in the proper perspective) is that you don't have TIME to make the decision, it is almost automatic.

But sadly a scum can thinkingly kill an officer and go on more or less with his life. An officer makes a snap decision and his world ends.

Yeah this was an officer trying to talk to some sfb kids. I personally would have had them call their parents. Get their parents there and explain this is a WARNING. Next they can get Junior at the Juvie Detention.

Another thing you may not realize is that I am betting this was not the FIRST warning the punks got.”

“Actually XL, I do understand that concept and issue but it has nothing to do with the initial example. The dude didn't freak out until the kid got lippy. He didn't cautiously walk up to them, he jawed back and forth from afar and when he'd had enough the ego kicked in and he confronted them. The issue at hand was an ego thing.

I totally empathise of the nightmare scenarios that can happen. It's dark, you see people at the end of a dark alley scrambling because they recognize it's a patrol car, you get out, confront, draw your weapon, and some kid goes for his belt. You can't clearly see what he's doing but have maybe a half a second to decide and you pull the trigger. The kid was grabbing whatever but it wasn't a gun. At this point you seem to want to call the kid scum, maybe he was, maybe he wasn't, but in my scenario he isn't acting as scum at that point in time which is important. The cop should be put on desk duty while there is an investigation, should be cleared and move on with life. The family will sue, will win, should win, insurance pays the billl and we all move on...well except for the kids mom. What I described is how it should probably play out, but that's rarely how it does play out. I'd say in that situation that cop still made a mistake, but mistakes happen when milliseonds count. It's the nature of the beast. I've made bad descisions when I had to make them quickly and later had to pull out the checkbook to pay for them. It sucks, but it's life. My bad decisions typically involve money, however if a building were to fall on someone you'd better believe it becomes about lives.”

“you don't have TIME to make the decision

yea, but this DUDE had plenty of time to measure his response and think about his actions. he was a large distance from all of them, in broad daylight, in public, lots of witnesses, up against a few 70 pound weaklings. he made the decision to get hostile and move in based on the fact that they called him "dude"

dude is a tool”

“LOL....ahh the freedom of second guessing....”

“we're second guessing against him, and youre second guessing for him”

“anyways, what you call "second-guessing" is just objective and impersonal judgement

but, i guess we should let all the criminals go, too. after all, we're just second and third guessing whether or not theyre guilty of a crime”

“I'm all too aware of second guessing. If I get sued for a mistake it's me personally, not some workers union. Just because the guy made a mistake in my example doesn't mean that a similiar person in a similiar situation wouldn't make the same decision a very high percentage of the time. Heck, I'd pull that trigger in that situation. But, if I was wrong the family should be compensated in some way by the city. Are you saying that's not correct?”

“The Cop and SBnazi should be put in a big Vita Mix blender and all of you should drink the very unimportant shake that results , FOR, you are what you eat.”

“Day I agree...IF the officer is wrong. Sadly I have seen way too many cases where the officer was acting on his best judgement....then politics reared its head.

Uncliff...call your doctor..you are suffering expressive dysphasia.”

“Agreed, that's why I put this line, "What I described is how it should probably play out, but that's rarely how it does play out"


You can still be wrong acting on your best judgement, but the key is you're acting on the available information at the time and that's all you have to go on.”

“http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23144420

Is this the sort of split second, life or death, no consequences or second guessing decision making skills you're talking about XL?”

“Ahhh, Florida's finest!”

“You watch the video...yeah is disgusting but its a pass...black officer, white victim...no biggie.


OH and Day, in my career I have ended the careers of 6 officers (three in Savannah and Three in Augusta) for failing or refusing to do their job.”

“LOL.

I'll admit to flame baiting but it just tied in too well to this mornings conversation.”

“I am Officer Riviera,. The sooner you learn that the longer you will live in this world!

Could that be considered a threat?”

“NO mild...there was not specific threat...and DAY....yeah I was enjoying the fun of Flame Baiting.

Personally I don't know what happened, I do know in MAJOR cities you tend to take a lot of officers and HOPE the training will weed them out.

I can say we had a situation in my county with a car fire (entrapment) where a Deputy and I got sorta nose to nose on my moving the truck. Ended up he called his supervisor I called mine...(LOL)His Supervisor is a good friend of mine. He had to learn the LAW>”

“Funny. The reason I asked is because I know a woman who got arrested for saying something very similar to her husband when she found out he was cheating on her. She said " I am your wife and you are supposed to love me and respect me, and if you don't you will die!" She said it right in front of 2 police officers who immediately slapped the cuffs on her and hauled her off. She didn't say I will kill you or I will shoot you, but they still took it as a threat . I guess it depends on the situation.”

“Bill depends on WHERE and what...I will Kill YOU is Assault.

The sooner you learn the longer you will live in this world is not TECHNICALLY a threat.”

“I agree.”

“what a great afternoon read”

“what are we talking about?”

“just glancing through quickly it looks like dayhiker and XL each agree, are also aware, and understand one another on whatever it is they are discussing. Of course I only read the first few words of their dialog, so it's possible that I might have missed something.


last edited: 2/13/08 1:51:45 PM”

“dun, go back and read from post one...a very good read, i highly recommend

...or let me summarize

1. Sarge posts a thread, seemingly just for fun. (though he's smiling with delight at the possibility of a good TT campfire)
2. Various people acknowledge that the cop was way over his bounds.
3. XL comes a long (panties in bunch) saying that EVERYONE'S opinions are invalid cause they've "never worn the badge".
4. Sarge strokes XL
5. Crash and Day have well thought out responses addressing all of XL's "concerns".
6. XL ignores those responses but instead posts more irrelevant "tales from the street"
7. The thread quickly dissolves in to smart ass remarks and jokes, we all laugh, hug and become friends again.”

“Thrifty isn't that the TRUE spirit of Trail Talk?

Heck I remember better knock downs in the past with Jerber and some of the old sters....”

“8. thrifty interjects his spin.”

“I didn't see any spin. I wish thrifty had posted his cliff notes version this morning and saved us all a lot of spit and vinegar.”

“I didn't see any spin. - dayhiker

Crash and Day have well thought out responses addressing all of XL's "concerns". - thrifty


LOL ... You wouldn't! hehe”

““That man has low self esteem because he has to drive a clown car and wear a funny outfit.”

Yeah, kind of hard to give Officer Tacklberry his due props when he drives a golf cart and wears short pants. LOL!”

“It's likely the car and the get up that's got him so pissed.”

“Ah, so the little car's got 'em pissed off! That explains why Buddha Bear acts like someone lit the fuse on his tampon...

”

“LOL...I remember when they made some of the street patrol officer start driving the "meter maid mobiles" to save gas...LOL...”

“The video is on the MSN front page now.”

“the guy got suspended, LOL”

“yep....the truth will be out...but then..is it the truth or WHAT the Leaders Want the truth to be?

I am glad I don't have to put up with the crap the low paid street officer has to eat each day.”