Iraq Going Well (Bush Right Again!!!)

“As I remember this country had at least 19 terrorist before 9/11. And yes ,I believe we should has invaded the USA and we should still be occupying it.”

“and were instrumental in the conquering of Germany

The russians might have something to say about that...”

“"MarkO...It took this adminstration less time to take Iraq than it too Janet el Reno to take Waco (LOL)."

So, its over??

Why are we losing 45 boys per month, and a female here and ther??

Over 18,000 wounded, too.

Man, I gotta start watchin' the TV news again.
I'm missin' a lot.

Ha ha, hee hee, ho ho!!!”

““and were instrumental in the conquering of Germany

The russians might have something to say about that...”
Mutt
8:11:01 AM
5/10/06

I think I said that.....too lazy to scroll up.

Is that somehow not true??

Lend/Lease, huh?

I do realize that the Russians lost 7.5 million KIA and the Germans, about 3.5 million KIA.......by the way.”

“MarkO...this is good, okay, what is the average loss of life in PEACE time for soldiers?
Of course you don't care, you and every other socialist will continue to believe what you want to believe....you remind me so much of the Soviet Woman in the 1980's who visited Charleston. Everything she saw was a CIA Plot...not true, garbage made up for her....Until we stopped at a grocery store. She watched a poor lady with a half a dozen urchins in tow go in and start loading her cart. The Woman broke down and collapsed...she had never seen so much food in her life.”

“There ya go, callin' me a socialist again!

I can play that game.....you are a fascist pig!

Come on, Musolini is your hero, right?

Or is it Francisco Franco??

That Tojo Hidecki guy really rocked, huh?

Turn off your AM radio, dude.”

“LOL>...hit a nerve there huh? Its okay, we still need socialists....so that our kids can see what they are ...kinda like keeping an example of Poison Ivy....as a warning.”

“Get real, you are not a fascist and I'm not a communist......or a socialist.

You may however be paranoid delusional.

Your style went out with McCarthy about 50 years ago.

Democracy is just a little too moderate for ya, huh?

You should get checked out under the bonnet.”

“XL, thanks I've wondered why americans are fatsoes. Marko's got a point about that 50's AM radio, for people that still wander around inside their cave looking for an 'EXIT' sign.”

“and I'm not a communist......or a socialist.

I know - I think the point people are making is that the well-spring of your ideology does indeed stem from the communists/socialists. As someone said, your buying into their propaganda (such as the anti-war crap you spew) shows you to be a stooge, or useful idiot, or whatever.”

“Mutt=Running Dog Of Fascism(Chicken Hawk)

All that stooge talk is straight out of the Stalinist playbook, it differs little from Hitler/Musolini/Franco.

The extremes are two sides of the ame coin.

Hail, hail Fredonia!!!”

“So did Ms. Teasdale ever bail you out?”

“Um, MarkO, if you think I'm parroting the guberment line or some other more nefarious political org, you're nuttier than I thought. I'm willing - and have - reevaluated my position on political topics. All I've seen from you is a consistent drone of war-for-oil, war-profiteers, bush-is-evil, and other communist-sponsored buzzwords.”

“The force is specifically limited to one hundred soldiers and consists of four officers, 23 NCOs, 70 halberdiers, 2 drummers, and a chaplain, all with an equivalent Italian army rank. Not only are the guards fully trained and equipped in modern tactics and weaponry, they also receive instructions in using the sword and halberd. The ceremonial weapon of the Guard is the halberd

After the May 13, 1981 assassination attempt on Pope John Paul II by Mehmet Ali Ağca, a much stronger emphasis has been made of the Swiss Guards' functional, non-ceremonial roles. This has included extended training in unarmed combat and with issue SIG P 75 pistols (a.k.a. P220) and Heckler & Koch submachine-guns.”

“OK Nutt, spin away!!

You're a fool, communists have no money with which to sponsor anyone.”

“I know - I think the point people are making is that the well-spring of your ideology does indeed stem from the communists/socialists. As someone said, your buying into their propaganda (such as the anti-war crap you spew) shows you to be a stooge, or useful idiot, or whatever.”

but that isn't the point is it. The point is that many people who turn these expressions like to use it to label anyone to the left of them. These are words with very negative connotations in the US after decades of (probably justified) cold war propaganda. The use of the words is aimed at provoking a gut response. Rather than build persuasive arguments as to why their rightist view is better they simply label anyone with different opinions socialist or communist. It's like all those people who like to use snappy catch phrases about the 'silly libbies.' People who use these words don't appear to be capable of establishing the merits of their own views and so simply try to group all the wide-ranging views held by others in the simple terms they can understand - socialist.

Unless someone is advocating the joint ownership of the means of production, then they are not really socialists or communists - especially those who simply want to maximize the benefits of capitalism and free markets. Even if you think this is the wrong way to achieve progress in America it doesn't mean that oppsoing views are communist.

'Socailist' also has different connotations to the rest of the world.

I would say, for example, that Chavez and Castro, with his program of nationalization, is socialist in nature. There are not many people in America who see the Cuban or Venezuelan model as a recipe for success in America.”

“Rather than build persuasive arguments as to why their rightist view is better they simply label anyone with different opinions socialist or communist.

Is "rightist" any better than socialist or communist?

You're point is taken, Y2. The labels we use are a matter of conversational convenience and are a questionable reflection of reality, at best. There still is a marked difference between the 2 sides here, though. On one hand we have the "rightists" making logical arguments based on facts. On the other hand, we have the "leftists" who ignore the argument and instead a) post-plagiarize anything and everything slanted against America (e.g. Violin), b) spout a bunch of nonsensical protest slogans of questionable origin (e.g. MarkO), c) rage on a completely juvenile emotional level (e.g. Buddha Bear), d) just plain never accept the validity of an argument while assuming an air of open-mindedness (e.g. Y2), or e) whatever I'm leaving out.

I'm really not "rightist" when considering my stance on social issues, but I sure as hell don't want to be associated with the leftists! ;-)”

“Now that I think of it, a lot of people here could be stylized into a cartoon characterization.... I wonder what I would be.”

“Oxy contin allows the tongue to pronounce only sounds like LLIIBBERRRAALLLLL!”

“Yeah - I think there do need to be some descriptive terms of political views, but socialist and communist have such negative associations in the US. Those with right-wing views have also successfully turned liberal into a negative word too.

I don't know about my views mutt - I have changed my views substantially since I've been here.

I did support the invasion of Iraq initially, feeling that once you draw a line in the sand you can't let it be crossed.
I now think it was a bad decision to move up to that line, given the evidence on the lack of threat Saddam really posed - and how effort and resources could have been better targetted in the fight against terror.

I can see there was a wider strategy than stopping WMDs in Iraq, but I think the chickenhawks have been proven to be naive in the extreme on what force could achieve. It was a nice plan on the drawing board, but has been executed badly.

I've never thought you can force democracy on a nation. Democracy is only as strong as the willingness of a poulation to support it.

I have changed my views on gun ownership since I've been here. Guns have always been and always will be a major part of American life. This doesn't mean that I think that any moron should own one. I'd just like some acceptance that there are costs as well and benefits to gun wholesale gun ownership.

I happen to think that people can own guns without major impediment without making them so easy for criminals to get hold of.

I think that widespread gun ownership works well in many parts of America, perticuarly the more rural settings. I think the number of guns in America makes it way too easy for criminals to get hold of them, causing huge problems in some of the country's biggest cities.

I'd like to think that just because I hold strong views and like to think I have support for them that I am not completely closed-minded to the alternatives.”

“Anyhoo, that's enough self-justification from me.”

“I've resorted to "slogans" after being hooted down here and called a commie for favoring representative democracy by the "to the right of Attila the Hun" crowd.

Just what is it that you guys admire so much about Attila, anyway?

The raping, killing or stealing?”

“RUMSFELD: WAR IN IRAQ GOING WELL ON EARTH II
Reports Significant Process in Parallel Universe

Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld today announced that despite the steady drumbeat of bad news about the war in Iraq, the war is actually going very well in the parallel universe known as Earth II.

Secretary Rumsfeld made his comments about Earth II in a press briefing at the Pentagon, where he blasted the press for "not reporting all of the good news coming out of Earth II."

With that, the defense secretary unfurled a map of Earth II, showing a terrain more familiar to science fiction fans and video game enthusiasts than to the general public.

According to the defense secretary, on Earth II Iraqi troops are being trained at a rate much faster than anticipated and the insurgency is "on the verge of crumbling."

Additionally, Iraqis have embraced democracy, causing freedom to flower in such neighboring countries as "Iran II, Egypt II and Saudi Arabia II."

Partially because of these gains, Mr. Rumsfeld said, President Bush's approval rating on Earth II currently stands at 89 percent.

Secretary Rumsfeld brushed aside a reporter's question about escalating violence in Iraq, saying that his new policy was to answer "no questions whatsoever" that involve Earth I.

"The press would be better served if they would get off the planet they're on and start living in a parallel universe, like all of us in this Administration do," Mr. Rumsfeld said.

- borowitzreport.com”

“McGovern Almost Ejected For Confronting Rumsfeld WMD "Lies"

"This is America," former CIA analyst says as security tries to drag him away

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/may2006/050506rumsfeldlies.htm




Freedom of speech almost. Just the sight of Rumsfeld makes me want to puke. How can such an administration based on lies and the wasted lives of American forces remain in office. I posted earlier right wing comments about the war in Kosovo. The right wing claimed that Clinton was starting WWIII. These same current war hawks watched on TV civilians being guned down by snipers if they entered the street. Young girls were raped with intention of impregnating the muslem girls with unwanted children. Evidence of mass graves and mass killings was unquestionable. Yet these war hawks were reluctant to stop the carnage. The removal of Saddam to free the Iraqie people could have been done justly. We invaded their country on the basis of lies. That is why we are seen as invaders and not liberators.
last edited: 5/10/06 12:59:56 PM”

“http://www.jessicaswell.com/MT/archives/000872.html

This is cool....so just how long have the "Hate America Crowd" wanted to say our military SUX????? 1946!!!! LOL...

I think we can end this with, you never change, like the alcoholic or addict you will keep blaming us for your negative views....”

“The Kosovo intervention was not the disaster it was decried to be.

I read that U.S. soldiers who served there were more likely to re-enlist, I suppose because of positive feelings about having done something real to help people.

Serving in a combat zone has the opposite effect on most, they want to get as far from that experience as they can.

Shattered bodies, shattered minds.

My uncle felt that way having lost his entire platoon in France and being severely wounded himself.......lost meaning all were KIA or WIA, except for the kid who dragged him to safety.”

“You're Batting 1000.”

“My Uncle lost entire COMPANIES around him at TARAWA, IWO JIMA, GUADACANAL, and Okinawa...but he never wanted to quit....MarkO how do you explain the 80 or so amputees who are fighting like hell to return to combat with prosthetic parts? Yeah it is so demoralizing...they WANT to go back...THOSE ARE THE TRUE HEROES.

As for FINDING SOME deep spiritual MEANING in WAR...there is NONE, as my Drill Sargeant said,"The Military exists to kill people and break things. WAR is won when you kill more of theirs or break more of their stuff."”

“So the Russians lost WW2 then XL? VC lost in Vietnam?

War is won when you achieve your objectives.”

“XL, just like Kosovo the Republicans were totally against entering WWII. Conservatives detested Franklin Roosevelt and it took the attack on Pearl Harbor win the support of the GOP. I actually believe that the attack was expected and allowed just so we could enter the war early enough to make a difference. WWII and Kosovo were two just conflicts entered into by US forces. Is it not ironic that the GOP tried to block our involvement in both.
last edited: 5/10/06 1:36:53 PM”

“LOL...the VC were wiped out during TET, following TET (see we actually wiped out the VC but the media made it look like a loss) the NORTH VIETNAMESE fought the rest of the war.

As for winning WW2...um the Russians destroyed (along with the other allies) all of Germany's stuff and killed a larger percentage of people....look at a map of the Soviet Union....it goes ALL THE WAY FROM POLAND to the Pacific...they had A LOT more people to lose....”

“Hay all you big strong men, uncle Sam needs.................................
.....kiss mygrass .I'm outa papers.”

“Bateaux///KOSOVO??/ Okay I assume you are referring to the UNILATERAL (NO UN ORDER) entry of the US in a locational conflict that had been going on since....um Alexander the Great. Yeah the only reason that originally drew us into WORLD WAR I, was the poor handling of the assasination of a third level idiot. Kosovo would not have resulted in another WORLD WAR. I know Billy needed a way to distract us from his HIGH crimes...but Kosovo was a joke.”

“War is won when you achieve your objectives.

Objectives of Iraq war:

1. Remove the continuing threat of Iraq on the U.S. national security. (objective met)

2. Remove need to enforce UN Security Counsel Resolutions regarding Iraq. (objective met)

Yah! We won!

Like I already said, "We are not fighting the same war we started in Iraq. This is another war."
last edited: 5/10/06 2:00:37 PM”

“XL, I don't think my uncle wanted to quit, he was sent home disabled.

He lead his platoon on what men of the 478 and 479 knew was a nearly suicidal mission on the morning of 14 Nov, '44 against Metz.
They assaulted reinforced positions and were caught in well-laid machinegun and mortar fire.
The Germans occupied parts of the Maginot Line as well as the fortress city of Metz.
The Germans didn't give up until they were out of food and ammunition.

The men of the 95th were carrying out Patton's hair-brained plans.
Have you ever heard of the Iron Men of Metz??

Can you, XL, tell me who dubbed the 95th The Iron Men Of Metz??
last edited: 5/10/06 2:14:52 PM”

“Sarge, Iraq was no more a threat to the U.S. than Iran is now.

Sure, they would love to have WMD, but they don't.
And even if they did, the U.S. has more.”

“Sarge, Iraq was no more a threat to the U.S. than Iran is now.

LOL! MarkO, you've been on a trolling roll this weekend. I love you man!

"Iran isn't a threat" ... you're so cute. Hitler wasn't a thread to the U.S. either, just his neighbors. Let 'em burn, right!? :)”

“Iran is taking over the world and we must stop them!!!

Go ahead Chicken Little.

Iran is a problem, but they are not intent on bombing the U.S.

The U.S.S.R. had a few more nukes than Iran(ZERO) and there was this little thing call deterrence that didn't involve sending thousands of American soldiers to their deaths.”

“feeding the troll ...

1. You brought up Iran, not me.
2. Are you against the Neighborhood Watch Program in your neighborhood?”

“Have another bite.....

Are you still beating your dog?”

“If by "dog" you mean "meat", then "yes".”

“Hey, it was just one of those stupid "questions" where you're a #&%!$ if ya do and a #&%!$ if ya don't.

Good answer though........you have a sense of humor after all!”

“http://www.townhall.com/opinion/columns/calthomas/2006/05/16/197438.html

Demoralzied Troops, Leaders changing their emphasis on NON Iraq and Afghanistan locales....seems the war is slipping away. DARN and the Big Puke Media missed this?”

“Like the vietnam war, the "insurgents" rely on Western media bias to win, because tactically and strategically they are losing. People like Violin, MarkO, and Y2 make their victory a possibility by drinking the kool-aid without critical thought. I don't know how they sleep at night.

What the insurgents need now is another high-profile media scumbag (like One-Worlder Walter Cronkite after the Tet offensive) to announce that we are losing and all is for naught.”

“News shovels,is that it?
last edited: 5/16/06 8:41:32 AM”

“Thank you Mutt....You know I wonder if we reported say that $7 TRILLION debacle (and countless lives lost) called Public Welfare in the same light...what would happen?”

“That set this contry back for a long while. We'll being saying the same , in a few years , about the Corp. welfare now so popular.”

“I thought you douchebags were all about personal responsibility.

Don’t try to shift the blame to those who said this was a bad idea three years ago.

You have blood on your hands and no amount of finger pointing will save your souls.”

“Don’t try to shift the blame to those who said this was a bad idea three years ago

Like me? I thought there were more pressing international issues at the time, but unlike you, I didn't summarily dismiss the real reasons for the Iraq war with emotional, intellectually adolescent "blood on your hands" histrionics. I prefered to retain credibility!

Violin, you're an interesting mix of educated rationality and propagandized emotionality. I wish you luck in maturing.”