Iraq Going Well (Bush Right Again!!!)

“The Iraqi delagates are walking out on thier own goverment and you expect the situation to improve in two months...

Either way in December the UN mandate for our presence in Iraq expires... I can only assume the shrub is going to thumb his nose at the UN as well.”

“...and you expect the situation to improve in two months...

You heard it here first.

Bush knows what he is doing, and partisan congress knows it. The rest is a dog and pony show.”

“I can only assume the shrub is going to thumb his nose at the UN as well.

When our country is not easily quick to do so, you will know my face.”

“Julia?
Are you awake?
There is truth, and there is untruth.
To be in a minority of one doesn’t make you mad.
Julia, my love...”

“sarge, you ignorant slut!

welcome back! really!”

“Hey pitts! Thanks.”

“Nigal: Congress is in such a f---ing muddle on Iraq, it would be a huge challenge for anyone to justify approving of how they have handled Iraq or what they are doing now. I think they know they need to wait until September, but want to look like they are doing something. So they are all chasing their tails and trying to look busy.

Now I am man enough to admit that it is much harder for Congress to appear competent because there are many more opinions and there is no one clear consensus as there is with Bush who has been beating the same drum for 6 years. Pull the plastic ring in his back and hear him talk kids!...."Stay the course. Stay the course. Stay the course.". He's a failure but he is very consistent in his failure. LOL!

The sad reality is that our leaders are not fighting this war to win. They are fighting it to not lose and as '08 approaches they are fighting it to win an election . They think we're too damn dumb to see it but we see right through them.”

“Hubris.”

“The dems are fighting to end it now and let bush take the blame , while the republicans are dragging thier feet so that whoever wins 08 will get blamed. Either way the american people are screwed....”

“Thanks for taking the time to answer a question I didn’t ask, Sarge. I figured when you said “the liberals” were predicting massive US casualties in the first month of the war, you were talking about people here. I can’t really take responsibility for what someone else says. My challenge was to go back through the threads and see what folks here were saying in the lead up to the invasion. I remember thinking that roseymonster was off base for predicting suicide bombers. Oh well…”

“My challenge was to go back through the threads and see what folks here were saying in the lead up to the invasion.

I wasn't even on trailtalk til 2 years later.”

“The impression that Bush is incompetent w/ Iraq is wrong. You guys need to stop focusing on baseing your viewpoints around talking points that dominate the media.

#1. Dems want us out of Iraq, but not because we're "failing". They want us out (the far left) because they believe America shouldn't have an advantage over other countries. The U.N. is where their loyalty lies.

#2. Bush is saying "stay the course", not because he's got nothing else to say, but because we're being very effective in our goals.

#3. Our goals (see #2) are
(a) To re-establish our military intelligence network in the middle east. This has been highly successful and will benefit America for decades, unless another Bill Clinton comes along and destroys that.
(b) To bring down our enemies (Iran/Syria/AlQaeda...).
(c) To set the stage for the future stabilization in the country/region.

#4. Nobody is dragging their feet. Things are happening quickly, as planned.

In these goals we are being successful, even if it may not look like it. Soon, this will become more apparent to everybody.
last edited: 8/04/07 6:58:12 AM”

“Oil will back down, money will flow into the hands of the hired allies and uncle Ben will cut rates for the stock market to give us another few months more to build all of our preeminemt permanent bases. Congress will coninue to be congress, but maybe they will come to the realization that new laws are worthless when the old laws mean nothing.”

“I always thought "HUBRIS" would make a great vanity plate for a Series I E-type.


Yeah -- we're WAY screwed.”

“All I want for Xmas is another car
and pleassssse, not another Forguar.”

““How do we know how to interpret those death rates?”
Sarge
7:04:30 AM
8/03/07

I can offer no formula on how to value a life or a death. Its certain worth sober and honest consideration.”

“Yes it is.

It's a tricky task. Problem is, I asked you how to interpret the death rates, and you answered as if I asked about value of "a life" (or death). I suppose your way we'd want to look at each individual life and ask ourselves a number of questions - "Was this a good guy, or a bad guy?", "Did he/she threaten America/freedom/others?", "Was he going to become a bad guy?", "Is this a victim of 'friendly fire'?", "If so, was it worth the death?" .... on and on ...

Using my formula we'd be asking higher-level questions such as "Are the bad guys using human shields?", "If so, should we be willing to take their lives?", "Is a terrorist family/shield a target?", ... things like that ...

I think people on "the left" tend to focus on the former questions, and on "the right", the later.

I guess my point is that any "death rate" doesn't help us to determine the feasibility of a war until we understand these questions in the context of what is at stake.”

“I feel privileged, as a humble atheist, to sit in on a dressed rehearsal of 'god speaks'.”

“Please explain that.”

“Did 19 men ask the question? Would they fall to the former or later if they did?

Standpoint, again does indicate 19 different views. Two sides can only wish to define our existance and that wish will be on vacation until the broader view is applied.”

“wow cliff, that was some good peyote....”

“For the goofballs aping the McCarthyesque talking points about Rep Clyburn above, context is everything: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/video/2007/07/30/VI2007073001325.html”
violin
5:04:47 AM
8/03/07

Thanks for the link, Violink. It is clear that Clyburn is an intelligent, articulate gentleman who has a well informed knowledgeable of policy.

We can discount his statements being a slip of the tongue as some have said, he truly believes that winning in Iraq is bad news for Democrats.

Calling me a goof ball McCarthyist for recognizing he wants to see failure in Iraq for political gain is preposterous. There is no doubt that Democrats want our soldiers to fail. This is why the Democratic Congress has a 3% approval rating on their handling of Iraq.

Sacrificing Americans for political gain is inexcusable.”

““Did 19 men ask the question? Would they fall to the former or later if they did?
Standpoint, again does indicate 19 different views. Two sides can only wish to define our existance and that wish will be on vacation until the broader view is applied.”-uncliff


Thank you salebored.”

“The peyote was to replace a bad taste from a cocktail above.”

“Don't confuse a cocktail with a fine wine.

Let us know when you run out of wit so we can talk.”

“I was really never with wit and should have known to never respond to any of your post. I will cutail all comments and will put you on ignore. this is my only potion.”

“Uh ... ok. Yeah, you should have known never to respond to any of my posts, because .... why again? Sorry if me asking you to speak with clarity offended you. I can see how that would make you offended, and in hindsight, it was rude of me to ask that we converse without using riddles. - /sarcasm”

“I guess the fact that the majority of americans want Iraq to end now is also motivated by poilitcal gain as well. People are pissed at the dems becuase they didnt have the balls to force the issue.”

“Lumberjack, I really don't think it's about balls. I believe that anybody close to this knows that it's unreasonable to end it now. They may not say it, because they are trying to make Bush look bad and "take back America", but the reality is that it's a ludicrous idea, and they know it. It's not about not having the balls, it's about realizing the reality of the situation.”

“Its really about not having 66 or 67 votes.”

“For the extremists, that's true.”

“Its really just a matter of rooting out pockets of Bushist dead-enders.”

“3% approval ratings. Wasn't it just last week someone said that it's not about approval ratings (I agree with that, btw).”

“Violin - Yanking out the troops would cause so many problems for us and others, if you think being there is a problem, you can't fathom trying to solve the problems that would come from yanking them out.

But, you will be able to say "Bush took us to war and lost." At least you'll get that satisfaction, right?”

“It sure isnt about approval. Its more likely about money and how much the conservative republican big wigs will lose if we do pull out. Oil rights, defense spending and dont get me started on the shrubs pet company haliburton.

It is said a budget should reflect the priorities of a person. We have lots of money for military action in Iraq and little for education, enviromental, humanitarian or infrastructure issuses...Whats in your wallet?
last edited: 8/06/07 6:21:13 AM”

“We have lots of money for military action in Iraq and little for education, enviromental, humanitarian or infrastructure issuses...Whats in your wallet?

Lumberjack, what's in your constitution? Last I checked, there isn't a direct relationship between education and spending. The issues you mentioned are state's issues. We're talking about "federal" government when we speak of the President.”

“Sarge, Lumber and a lot of Libbies want a strong Central Government becuase this allows some people to make decisions for the WHOLE country regardless of the apparent applicability to other areas.

If for instance you have screwed up once great schools (Say like NY City) you can say "Well the whole country is having problems." Then you don't have to look at the crappy conditions of your life, you just pawn it off. Its part of the Whole Society of Victimhood the libbies like.

Kinda like the urban outdoorsman who ignores the fact that he is too hooked on Alchohol to get or hold a job but his excuse is "hey this could happen to you."”

“Sounds like Ron Paul may be effecting some of the thinking hear. You could do alot worse than to listen to Dr. No.”

“uncliff, I'm sorry if you were offended the other day by my post. I simply wanted you to restate your opinion in a clear manner. I'm interested in what you have to say, I just can't understand any of it. You speak in riddles and I don't think it's clever - don't take offense to that, it's just past the point of being silly. You obviously have a lot of thoughts on these matters, so why not express them so that they're relayed clearly? That's all I'm saying. If you want to continue to speak in meaningless riddles (like salebored), fine, no problem, I was just asking.
last edited: 8/06/07 6:58:52 AM”

“I have to agree that a precipitous withdrawal would be a bad thing and that there is a high likelihood that new problems will follow a US withdrawal.

The first question is: is there a better course than a precipitous withdrawal?

I'd like to think there is. Really there has to be. I'm inclined to give those who say there is a shot.

The second question is: Is there any chance that the current administration will follow a course that will leave us better off than if we had a hasty withdrawal?

I'm less optimistic on this, but this administration is the only one we have and a chaotic withdrawal with Dems and Reps, Congress and the President fighting over the reigns of power seems ugly.

The sequelae of the Soviet-Afghan conflict stands as a warning here. Look at the forces that were unleashed. Iraq offers prospects of something far, far worse.”

“Here is WHO we are fighting...they are not there "becuase" we are there, if we were not fighting them in Iraq we would be fighting them here.

http://my.break.com/media/view.aspx?ContentID=344444”

“Is that because anyone could drive huge trucks with ICBMs through the border as long as they they were camouflaged with drugs tied all over them.”

“WTF are you talking about...? The photos of Russian vehicles removing equipment from Iraq for Syria before the invasion?

OH well yeah but that doesn't matter you know Republican President and all....(LOL)”

“You don't buy into the 'Iraq Distraction' as for the the main reason for invasion? If we leave over there we have to bring worries back to where they belong.”

“XL - your 180 out of it as usual, I prefer strong local goverment with the federal level severly restricted in its functions. Both congress and the white house have gone way beyond the intentions of the constitution and need to be reined in.

Re: Ped, I dont see any real options at this point unless you are willing to forceably relocate people and redraw the borders. Political suicide...

XL - they were not in Iraq before we came. All our war in Iraq has done is sap the resolve we had to fight terrorism at it source.

We are standing in front of a breaking dyke with our finger in it. If you will excuse me... its time to go :)”

“XL - they were not in Iraq before we came.

yeah, they were in NY.”

“and from?”

“the AlQaeda terrorist group.”

“Which country would you like us to wrangle them into?”