Who believes in Global Warming?

“"Antartica? LOL!

You mean where the ice sheet is growing?"

Is that a Land Of Tarts?

Well, the bull sheet is growing at TT.”

“http://www.usatoday.com/news/science/cold-science/2002-01-18-wais-thicker.htm

http://www.nasa.gov/lb/vision/earth/environment/sea_ice.html

http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/antarctic_020822.html

even commondreams put their spin on it: http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/0520-08.htm”

“Averaging these two vehicles gets me 50 MPG.

We can average out our expenditures? Is that like buying carbon credits? Can I average in my walking too?

Now, what vehicles do you drive? Please name all of them and the current EPA standards for gas mileage.

Um, you don't see me complaining about our cars destroying the environment, do you?

Also, if you put 200,000 miles in 10 years on ONE of your TWO cars (which you averaged together) - then I also drive less than half the miles you drive, saving on the environment even more. My contribution to "global warming" is much much less. But, I don't believe in that anyways, so it's irrelevant.

I find the Gore-wannabees are just as hypocritical as he is.
last edited: 1/03/08 10:00:35 AM”

“"Also, if you put 200,000 miles in 10 years on ONE of your TWO cars (which you averaged together) - then I also drive less than half the miles you drive, saving on the environment even more. My contribution to "global warming" is much much less. But, I don't believe in that anyways, so it's irrelevant."

WHAT DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING AT ALL????

And you still didn't answer my original inquiry. You're a slippery as the administration you elected...”

“WHAT DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING AT ALL????

It has EVERYTHING to do with what YOU asked me! You asked me what I drive and the kind of mileage I get, implying that you do better for the environment than I do - when the reality is, I, somebody who doesn't believe in all the hype as you do, actually cause LESS harm to the envirnoment by my driving habits.

Let's assume you were being truthful when you average the two cars of yours, and you actually do 400,000 miles of driving on 10 years.

My wife and I TOGETHER average 75,000 miles in ten years.

My car gets 24 mpg total in real-driving.

Your 50mpg * 400,000 = 2 million gallons (for 1 person?)

My 24mpg * 75,000 = 1.8 million gallons for 2 people.”

“And you still didn't answer my original inquiry. You're a slippery as the administration you elected...

I can answer it all day long - but it won't change anything because ... now listen carefully ... I'm not being hypocritical!

In fact, if you drove cars like I do you'd be LESS hypocritical than you currently are.

Are you getting any of this?

You've spent a lot of time on trailtalk telling others how THEY should live their lives differently, but you seem unwilling to do so yourself.”

“"...implying that you do better for the environment than I do..."

Sorry. Forgot the whole world was out to get you. Actually, I wasn't doing any implying. That is something you drummed up in your obviously defensive state. I was merely curious how you got on your whole high horse.

400,000 miles? Ha. You're making some serious assuption, dood. I don't even come close to 20K a year. My family lives and works within three miles of where we live. I can walk to work if I needed to. Quite often I ride my bike. We are a one car family. The other vehicle is a scooter. The majority of our car driving is done on the highway, traveling to the amazing outdoor settings this large state has to offer.

Let's take a look at your fuzzy math. At most, we probably drive the vehicles 10-15K a year, bringing the total to 100,000 to 150,000K over 10 years. 50 mpg. 100,000/50=2,000 gallons or 150,000/50=3,000 gallons.

Let me correct your math for you. It's division, not multiplication. 75,000/24=3,125 gallons.

Yes, Sarge. You drive less than I do. However, I am getting over twice the miles per gallon that you are and therefore, can drive twice as far.
last edited: 1/03/08 10:57:31 AM”

“But, since you do not like the average of vehicles, and I am giving you the benefit of the doubt when you say you only have one vehicle and that the 24 mpg you post is highway driving? Agst my only car a 29 mpg, or even 25 combined, then yes, you consume less gas than me per year if that is your point.

I drive further and therefore, use more gas.”

“"You've spent a lot of time on trailtalk telling others how THEY should live their lives differently, but you seem unwilling to do so yourself.”

Oh, and that is REALLY rich.”

“rosey, I applaud your use of the vespa, but do you really use it for 1/2 your yearly mileage? if you drove it everyday to work (6 miles round trip) thats at the most 1600 miles per year. I assume you also use it to run errands so we'll double that. Say 3200 miles per year. I am not saying anything about your carbon footprint, just interested in the breakdown of the miles between your two vehicles.

I had too look up what a vespa 200 was :). I thought it was one of those Mr. Bean cars. Those things hold a good value. I saw them listed from $2500 to $4000. I just bought a '86 Honda Shadow (55 mpg average) for $500. Figured I save on gas money only I didn't count on the 200-300 mile fun rides that serve no purpose other than the thrill of the ride :).”

“Highway. No doubt, the mileage is not spilt evenly between the vehicles. The Vespa, though highway legal, is best suited for city use. Basically, it is driven year-round for city use. I probably put about 3-4K on it a year, so your estimate is correct. Yup. They are worth some coin for what they are. Gas prices help to revive the value from time to time. I am currently building a screamer (well, for a scoot) in my basement that I hope to have that done in the next few months.

Once again, Sarge wanted to stir up some sheyat. Then again, this is a fuego thread.”

“Some of you need to go where the steering wheel is on the right side. I get 3T oatmeal per mile- so kiss my dirty socks( Walmart old man nylon $1.37 pair).

If you didn't know, even all electric cars are measured in comparable miles per gallon of gasoline.
last edited: 1/03/08 11:35:04 AM”

“3T (tablespoons?) of oats per mile?

uncliff, do you live in Amish country and drive a horse and carriage? I can't decide if you are starving or overfeeding your horse.”

“I killed the horse, hell, I could run faster and I look better pulling the wagon (cause then I can't be on it- the wagon that is).”

“oh oh, off teh wagon, looks like your "fuel" consumption is going way up.”

“From Sarge's NASA link:

Typically, warming of the climate leads to increased melting rates of sea ice cover and increased precipitation rates. However, in the Southern Ocean, with increased precipitation rates and deeper snow, the additional load of snow becomes so heavy that it pushes the Antarctic sea ice below sea level. This results in even more and even thicker sea ice when the snow refreezes as more ice. Therefore, the paper indicates that some climate processes, like warmer air temperatures increasing the amount of sea ice, may go against what we would normally believe would occur.”

“pedxing - so you agree that Marko was wrong in laughing that the continent's ice shelf is growing?”

“400,000 miles? Ha. You're making some serious assuption, dood. I don't even come close to 20K a year.

rosey -

You said on the other thread: I drove the Toyota stationwagon pretty much into the ground. 200K miles and somehow popped a hole in the gastank. Having already replaced to other gastanks (mountain roads, sitting in the sun for a year while we were in south america), it was time to let the old girl go. They say after 10 years or more you get emotionally attached to your vehicle. I think of how many trips we took in her, how many mountain roads that led to such great adventures, the only car my dog has only known, etc. and it is a little sad.

Then on this thread you said: It gets 20 in the city and 29 on the highway under the new standards -- about 25 combined. But my daily driver is a 1976 Vepsa P200. It gets 70 miles per gallon. Averaging these two vehicles gets me 50 MPG.


So, if your one car is driven 200,000 miles in 10 years, and that is HALF (you averaged the two to get total mpg), then your total driving is 400,000 miles in ten years.

Unless you owned that car for way more than 10 years, the numbers are pretty close.
last edited: 1/03/08 12:07:03 PM”

“Highway. No doubt, the mileage is not spilt evenly between the vehicles.

Then why did you try to deceive us by averaging the two vehicle's MPG?”

“3250 miles each a year for the past ten years huh?”

“No deception. Just the average of my vehicles in mpg. That's the fact.

I bought the car with 70K on it. So actually, I drove 130K over 10 years, about 13K a year. Mileage per year varied.

Your just mad because you can't do third grade math.

Again, done with this conversation, Sarge. You always make everything really unappealing to continue with as you continuously insinuate everyone is being deceptive. Just board up your shack, bust out the MREs, and wait for boogeyman.”

“It is deceptive. The average of your cars mpg means nothing if it isn't reflective your driving habits. How is it not? Why even mention it? Conversations would go more smoothly and nicely if there was more honesty.”

“I did screw up the math. Let's correct it -

13k * 10 = 130,000 * 2 = 260,000 miles
vs
7.5k * 10 = 75,000 miles

260,000 / 50 = 5,200 gallons
vs
75,000 / 24 = 3,125 gallons / 2 (people) = 1562.50 gallons

WOWZA! That's more than 3 x that gas expenditure!!

But, you probably buy carbon credits or something, right?”

“You are thick. I already stated your assumption about my mileage was completely incorrect. But whatever makes you feel superior.

Let's apply some Sarge logic.

Penn. = 46,055 square miles.

CA = 163,707 sq.m

WOWZA! That's more than 3 x the land mass!”

“Oh ... so you're justifying your more than 3x gas expenditure by where you live?

So, the left expects everyone else to change their lifestyle in order to "save the planet", but it's okay if they don't?

I don't even believe in this hype, and I purposefully picked my house in a central location to all of my activities to minimize driving expenses.

If California is such a wasteful place to live, maybe the left coast needs to move!

(or else buy more carbon credits)”

“I'm cool with the West Coast ceding entirely from the union.”

“LOL!”

“And YET...not one thing has been proven..THAT IS PROVEN...to actually CAUSE Global Warming....we can show there may be Climate Change...but NOT a THING has been Proven that shows mankind is having an impact.

Not the "Salem Witch Trial" type "Science" but I want HARD irrefutable evidence that the successful nations need to be punished more than the real polluters.

Sorry all I see so far from the High Church of EnvrioSocialisim is "the successful must share the pain" to save the world.”

“I'm just amazed that Sarge manages to drive about 1/6 of the miles of the average american male of his age group - his wife about 1/4 to 1/5- and they've both managed it for the past 10 years.

Age Male Female Total
16-19 8,206 6,873 7,624
20-34 1 7,976 12,004 15,098
35-54 18,858 11,464 15,291
55-64 15,859 7,780 11,972
65+ 10,304 4,785 7,646
Average 16,550 10,142 13,476

http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/ohim/onh00/bar8.htm
last edited: 1/03/08 2:30:13 PM”

“Crap...I do almost DOUBLE that each year.”

“Actually y2, that number would be (will be) a lot lower, but I included all of our years together, which includes a summer where we were separated by an hour, 1 way drive, which I would often make once or twice a day to see her. I racked up a bunch of miles that summer. I posted our actual average, but typically (9 out of 10 years) our mileage is quite a bit less than what I posted.

And, your math is off, btw.
last edited: 1/03/08 2:41:40 PM”

“well ok, make it 1/5 and a 1/4 for you and the Mrs then.”

“Again, way off. First of all, I originate most of the driving, so at least 90% of that is me driving. She drives much less, simply for lack of need. She just drove herself to the gym, but usually we'd go together. I am recovering from the flu, so I didn't go. I drive her to work, it's on the way to my work. So I drive closer to 2/5 (almost half) of average, and she is closer to 1/33rd.”

“LOL

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080103/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/mexico_cold_weather;_ylt=AjbZmCooqFMmyDU7TSwHe.ZvaA8F

MEXICO CITY - A cold snap has brought freezing temperatures, unusual snows and heavy rains to Mexico and Central America, and authorities said the weather may be to blame for several deaths.

Snow is not uncommon at very high altitudes in Mexico during the winter, but this week's cold front brought frost and light snow to towns that normally don't see such weather. In the capital, residents accustomed to 80-degree afternoons bundled up in temperatures as low as 32.

The front also brought heavy rains, high winds and pounding waves to Central America. In Honduras, a 65-year-old woman drowned trying to cross a rain-swollen river, dozens were evacuated from flooded areas and two airports closed briefly.

In neighboring El Salvador, winds ripped the roofs off some buildings and forced emergency officials to set up temporary shelters for those left homeless.


LOL The religion of Socialisim takes another Kick in the Cojones (Sarge like How I worked in the Spanish Lingo...thats gotta piss off the libbies)”

“Stupid hick.”

“There is of course one other minor problem with the global warming.... Greenland use to be a lot warmer.....I wasnt always covered in ice...”

“http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2008/01/06/br_r_r_where_did_global_warming_go/

THE STARK headline appeared just over a year ago. "2007 to be 'warmest on record,' " BBC News reported on Jan. 4, 2007. Citing experts in the British government's Meteorological Office, the story announced that "the world is likely to experience the warmest year on record in 2007," surpassing the all-time high reached in 1998.

But a funny thing happened on the way to the planetary hot flash: Much of the planet grew bitterly cold.

...

Given the number of worldwide cold events, it is no surprise that 2007 didn't turn out to be the warmest ever. In fact, 2007's global temperature was essentially the same as that in 2006 - and 2005, and 2004, and every year back to 2001. The record set in 1998 has not been surpassed. For nearly a decade now, there has been no global warming. Even though atmospheric carbon dioxide continues to accumulate - it's up about 4 percent since 1998 - the global mean temperature has remained flat. That raises some obvious questions about the theory that CO2 is the cause of climate change.”

“Gee, who could've foreseen this.”

“

For nearly a decade now, there has been no global warming.



wowza”

“But, but, but global warming actually entails global cooling! Everyone knows that. [/Y2]”

“LOL...”

“If your date range is set to 5 days, look back a page.

Especially if you're a global warming alarmist or believer.

That's it ... click the << prev”

“Sell your straw hats fools.”

“Nothing exemplifies the Axis of Idiots more than thier laughable position of Global Warming.
Current Weather - 63 degrees!”

“Amount of global warming in a decade ...

0”

“The name-calling did show up right on cue though, di'n't it? LOL”

“Ohhhh, another conservative columnist opinion spot for the desperate to cling to.

These are the warmest years on record.
the top 10 being 1998, 2005, 2003, 2002, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2001, 1997 and 1995.

"Nine of the 10 warmest years have happened since 1989,"

The Met Office originally predicted that 2007 could be the warmest on record globally. The year began with a weak El Nino, a Pacific Ocean phenomenon that normally raises temperatures.

But since the end of April 2007, its cooler relation, the La Nina, has prevailed, taking some of the heat out of what could have been an even warmer year.”

“How many of those are ties?”

“Keep going on that pick pick pick. You may find the tiniest of holes in the huge wall of evidence you face.”

“I mean in all reality, no matter what they are faced with - some people can NEVER admit global warming might be man made. If they do they have to admit that something needs to be done - (even the dumbest of the dumb can't admit that destroying the planet is a good thing) - and that could involve government action at some point - something they just can't accept.

To accept that action needs to be taken would destroy their soul as :
a) It would admit that 'a bunch of hippies' were right.
b) That uncontrolled market forces may have helped to create the problem. And nothing can stand in thew way of the market.

So as an alternative they just pick pick pick at anything to create some doubts.

It's all about creating a diversion - they do it constantly when stuff isn't going their way.”